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I killed 20 million of my own people.



joseph stalin

I killed 20 million of my own people.
But, you ask an American college student to name the worst world leader ever and all they talk about is this Bush guy…

(Joesph Stalin)

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  1. IndieTarheel says:

    Depends on the college student.

    Some would confer the dubious distinction on the guy who hasn’t been in office a year yet.

    Cognitive dissonance != politically dependent.

    • MaMaQ says:

      Nah – neither Bush nor Barry get dibs. School kids would name Hitler because of all the cool war propaganda movies that we cranked out.

      Besides, in order to take out Hitler… the enemy of our enemy (Soviet Russia) became our uneasy ‘friend’.

      *doh!*
      Isn’t history painful sometimes?

      • Adrimor says:

        And because of the Zionists always yelling about how “we must never forget”–meaning “we must never forget how many Jews died”, but not “we must never forget that mass slaughter is wrong”. Can’t forget about them.

        • Torus2112 says:

          That is…delicate territory, but yes based on the numbers, Stalin was worse than Hitler.

        • Dhoti says:

          It’s amazing, the kind of reaches that anti-Semites will make.

          • Redneck_Rebel says:

            Funny how it’s wrong to be anti-Semetic but apparently completely acceptible in every way to be anti-Christian…

            • Dhoti says:

              If you’re far enough left, both seem to be acceptable, even encouraged — it’s quite frightening, actually.

              Remember, kids, tolerance is for approved minority groups only.

            • Danbala says:

              What kind of antichristianism are you thinking of that’s compatible with antisemitism?

              • Danbala says:

                “that’s compatible with”? I meant “that compares to”.

                Fancy comp-words are just too hard for an ickle brain.

              • PortlandMark says:

                Um, you know. That whole “Happy Holidays” thing that the evil liberal corporations foist on us every September.

                  • PortlandMark says:

                    Well, I’m not sure I understand it, to be honest. I’m just repeating what O’Reilly says. :)

                    • Danbala says:

                      I can’t stand victim wannabe whiners.

                      We have some of this in Sweden. Our law says school education should be nonconfessional. Some schools have traditionally had their end-of-term gatherings in churches. (Either for religious tradition or simply because it’s a large building.) Lately people have started pointing out that this might be a bit silly – dragging off school classes to church on a regular basis.

                      Conclusion?

                      “Us Fine Good White Christians are being oppressed by evil darkie Muslims!!!111!!!1!”

                • Jane St.Clair says:

                  *hugs for Mark* Where you been, I’ve missed you!

                  • *hugs Mark too* Yeah, PM is here.
                    Uh.
                    This is a little awkward.

                    • PortlandMark says:

                      *awkward, one armed man hug*

                      Um, hi.

                      (furiously thinking, trying to figure out if I know you)

                      • Jane St.Clair says:

                        *whispers* That’s Eric in STL, he changed his name due to his membership in the PK irregulars on facebook. I think.

                        • PortlandMark says:

                          Oh, um, Hi Eric in STL! I didn’t recognize you in the *awkward pause* sequined jacket and fluorescent pants. Um, wow, what an… interesting look! The Amazing Rando, huh?

                          (Okay, srsly. Good to talk to you again, too, Eric! I hope your summer is going great!)

                        • Yeah, the name change is to try to make me more anonymous so PKers I don’t like won’t know who I am and people I know in real life won’t be able to hold me responsible for shit I say here. LOL

                  • PortlandMark says:

                    *hugs back*

                    Thanks, Jane! I missed you too!

                    I’ve been too busy this summer to get on much. I just started mountain biking last fall, and since the nice weather hit I’ve been spending every moment working, riding, or sleeping.

                    • Jane St.Clair says:

                      Awesome! I spent the summer eating junk food, I’m sure the physical results of your summer endeavors were better than mine. ;)

                      • PortlandMark says:

                        Kind of a mixed bag, actually; after 18 miles of mountain trail, nothing tastes better than a cold beer. Except, maybe, another cold beer. Followed by some burgers, and a token salad so I can feel “healthy” :)

                        I *do* have killer legs again, now!

      • fish eye no miko says:

        Conversely, some former(?) Nazis that helped hunt down Communists were given leniency.

        • Dhoti says:

          As were many of the regime’s scientists and engineers — there was a lot of German being spoken in Huntsville in the 50s and 60s. (To be fair, though, a lot of those folks were reluctant members, or “Nazis” in name only. NINO?)

          Political expediency and the start of the Cold War will do that to you.

  2. Czernobog says:

    I can barely focus on the caption with that glorious mustache above it.

  3. Bear says:

    Spoken to any college students lately? Or is that just supposed to be shorthand for liberal? Regardless, when your backers consistently rely on pointing out history’s greatest monsters to make you look good, your legacy’s prospects aren’t looking so hot.

    • Igloo McCoy says:

      I think when your only defense becomes, “Hey, at least I didn’t sponsor genocide” or “well at least I didn’t rape and kill my way through the continent” you’ve done something wrong.

      • Gustav says:

        Well, no, not a content. A middle eastern country…

      • Bip-D-Bo says:

        I know. It was so wrong of him to ask a couple thousand Americans to die just for the sake of freeing and saving the lives of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and Afganis. EVIL! EEEEVIIIILLLLL!!!!!!!

        • slan agat says:

          Do you mean the hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and Afghanis freed from this mortal coil? Or the millions living in a society more dangerously unstable than what was there before the war?

          • Igloo McCoy says:

            Errr, that wasn’t even directed towards Bush. I was just making a joke. And I’m not getting into the Iraq War with anyone…

          • Sigma says:

            It would be more stable if the government would put some real effort in improving the situation instead of calling it ‘hopeless.’ The amount of extremists killed or detained outnumbers U.S. casualties by, like, 500 to 1, and double that of civilians killed.

          • Bip-D-Bo says:

            You speak out of ignorance, just riding the mindless wave of public opinion. Iraq is “more dangerously unstable” only if you consider control (And I mean control by Saddam) and stability the same thing. If it weren’t for the Iraq war, the entire Kurdish race would likely be near extinction by now due to mass genocide. Go to http://www.theotheriraq.com to see what they think of our “invasion”. Also, Saddam would be well on his way to rebuilding his WMD programs. Read the intelligence reports.

    • Adrimor says:

      You do realize you could be talking about any politician ever here, right? ._.;

  4. Sqwirk says:

    Obama must be torn,

    should he grow a Stalin moustache or an Osama bin ladin beard?

    • Lammassu says:

      I’ve always been curious why Bush didn’t grow a Hitler mustache.

      • Bear says:

        Care to point out how you are any less ridiculous or offensive than Sqwirk’s?

      • foo says:

        Remember, both Hitler and Stalin were Socialists (Just like BO). Bush was a Republican, albeit not a very good one.

        Be afraid. Be very afraid.

          • Nailin Pailin says:

            What we should be afraid of are ignorant Republicons who are so desperate in their racism to smear Obama that they deny the fact that Hitler was a fascist, and that Bush’s grandpa Prescott was one of Adolf’s American bankers, and is alleged to have supported the aborted 1930’s fascist coup planned by wealthy Republicans in the U.S.

            And Stalin was a communist.

            And President Obama is not a socialist.

            I’m thinking that foo qualifies as a complete idiot.

            • VictoryNotVengeance says:

              Stalin wasn’t a communist. Stalin was a dictator. You see, communism is only a theory. It follows a long period of socialism known as the “withering away of the state”. In essence, after the socialist revolution, the dictatorship of the proletariat would reduce government salaries to a “working man’s wage” and devoid of privilege, like taking a plane to cheat on your wife in another country and that being ok. And over unknown years, as the theory suggests, the government would eventually dissolve into nothing more than a system of offices that handle trade of goods from areas with excess to areas of need. All ownership of means of production would also become owned by the state. After the bourgeois class was slowly dissolved because their ability to manipulate the masses through their private ownership of assets (factories and the like) would be taken away, everyone would become a middle class worker. Since the “State” only exists, according to Marx and Lenin, to keep the proletariat from rising against their bourgeois masters, it would slowly wither away as the classes vanish. Once they state had completely withered, then communism would replace socialism. So you see, you can’t really call anyone a communist. What you can call them is a Socialist. And since the state never withered away in any country that claims to be communist, your really should refer to any state as communist. The best one can hope for is “wanted a socialist revolution with the hopes of the state one day withering into a state of communism”. Do you dig?

              • charro says:

                Gravity is only a theory..

                • viking gal says:

                  It is the Law of Gravity. Gravity got an upgrade from physics a while ago. Gravitrons are a theory, however.

                  • Danbala says:

                    OH NOES. You mean I have to fall down when I trip over now? I’ve always kinda hoped that I occasionally wouldn’t, since it was all just theoretical. :/

                    • viking gal says:

                      Falling down is only to be avoided by massively embarrassing flailing motions. It’s the law! OK, it is the law for me, anyway!

                    • bodo says:

                      The other law (or corollary), which isn’t talked about so much, is that you can only trip (or stumble) if there’s someone there to see it.

                      • viking gal says:

                        Uh oh! I’ve been violating the law then! I trip, regardless of an audience! Am I under arrest?!

                        • bodo says:

                          Nah, it’s more of a corollary, really. “If a person trips in the hallway, and there’s no one there to see it, did it make an embarrassment?”

                        • bodo says:

                          (but you might want to get your equilibrium checked…that’d be the semi-circular tubules in your inner ear that allow you to determine your relative spatial…what’s that? “Shut up already?” Oh, ok, sorry.

                          Although it could also be something with your eyesight where *thwack* OK I’LL STOP, SHEESH. ow.)

                        • slan agat says:

                          Yes, you are. Now hold still while I get these fuzzy handcuffs on you…and the bedpost…

                    • charro says:

                      I float.

                  • charro says:

                    Hrmpth. Fine then.

                    *amends post*

                    Evolution is only a theory..

                  • VERY satisfied charro says:

                    Hey asshole, when I was in school, gravity was taught as a theory. In fact, if you want to put a fine point on it, GRAVITY may be a law but it is explained through THE THEORY OF GRAVITATION. So we explain a law with a theory, hmmm? Since BASIC SCIENCE CLASS IN 7TH GRADE I haven’t much followed gravity’s progress as I don’t give a shit and I didn’t get my degree in hard science.

                    And anti-evolution types who say evolution is just a theory are the ignorant ones, because they wouldn’t know a scientific theory if it bit them on their self righteous ass.

              • bodo says:

                See, that’s exactly what I’ve always thought (well, since high school in the 1970s, anyhow) – all the so-called “communist countries” were (or are) really dictatorships. While I think the concept of communism is great, I can’t imagine it actually working with people (you know who you are) in a practical way. I guess I hang around with the wrong crowd…

            • Mr Different says:

              Please tell me why it is that every Republican who doesn not approve of Obama is automatically labeled a “racist”? Isn’t it possible for someone to simply not like him for his character, opinions, efforts, and tactics?
              And just because someone’s grandfather is with bad company or even a bad person does not make the grandson a bad person. Perhaps Bush wasn’t the best president; but at least he never brought shame to the U.S. by apologizing to Europe for Americans, calling cops “stupid”, or try to rush a major decision like Healthcare even though polls say majority of the people say nay.
              My opinions are obvious, and they’re just that… opinions. But my are based on research. I am all for opinions, even if they’re opposite of mine, as long as they are actually educated. I despise when people voice views that were fed to them by peers, media, and other outlets. If you hear a claim, especially one as drastic as “Bush is worse than Stalin”, look into it. Don’t just agree to it because someone says it! I’ll tell ya, if the citizens of this nation did some research on the topics about which they are so passionate, the First Amendment would be put into much better use. I’m glad we have it. So I can express myself like this and rebuttal views like yours, I just wish your views were more educated.

              • slan agat says:

                No one here is claiming Bush is worse than Stalin, so you can just put the crack pipe down and back away from that claim, thank you.

                As it happens, the past eight years merited an apology for the way GWB and his administration conducted themselves. I’m not going to waste bandwidth and my time with an exhaustive list; if you’ve truly lived through the period and are as educated as you insist others should be, you can think of them yourself. Nobody called the cops (plural? what?) stupid, just one cop’s action on one occasion, and if you can’t figure out the difference you’ve got some serious maturing to do. And the decision on health care reform has not been rushed – this stuff has been pending since 1948, with the same well-heeled fools making the same arguments the whole time.

                You’re welcome to try again.

              • Research, huh? Please cite your sources for your research because I have a feeling hypocrisy is afoot!

            • meooot says:

              “The term Nazi is derived from the first two syllables of Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, the official German language name of the National Socialist German Workers’ Party “

              • viking gal says:

                And one of their main purposes was to be anti-union and anti-communist. In spite of the name, NOT socialist. Rather like the USSR not being a union, but instead a military-enforced collection of countries.

                • mc says:

                  lol.
                  some of that countries are now begging to take them back )))
                  split was initiated by betrayers and not supported by people (except nationalist aka separatists).
                  How about ‘EU is NATO enforced collection of coutries’ ??
                  sound like bs, right? ))

              • subtlefuge says:

                Gee, if Hitler called his party “socialist,” it must be true because everything Hitler ever said was completely, absolutely true!

                In other news, China must be the most democratic nation in the world given that its full name is the “People’s Republic of China.”

        • VictoryNotVengeance says:

          Neither Hitler or Stalin were socialists. They were both dictators. Now Lenin… Lenin was a socialist. He promised his people peace, healthcare, and schools. Ofcourse, the elites started a civil war because they didn’t want to lose thier power and the west, including America, sent troups and supplies to fight the Red Army. It could even be said that if not for the Civil War that ensued and the continuation of German attack during WWI there would not have even been a Stalin. And even though he did horrible things, he did take the most backward “western” country and make them capible of winning WWII. From last the tied with first isn’t such a bad go at it.

          • FrankiiDoodle says:

            Lenin was also a dictator, any communist leader has to be, that’s how the system works.

            • mc says:

              every eastern leader has to be a dictator.
              dont you get it?
              it works for thousands of years and will work.
              when you bring a ‘democracy’ to that nations – you just kill the whole ecosistem.
              millions die without a bullet.
              I think this is the point of “spreading the virus”.

          • bodo says:

            Just curious – what if that other guy – Lev Davidovich Bronstein – had been the leader – whatcha think would’ve happened? I don’t have an axe to grind or even a particular opinion about it, I’m just curious about people’s opinions here.

        • common_sense says:

          Hitler was a fascist.. not a socialist.

          • meooot says:

            You don’t know what Nazi stood for, do you?

            “The term Nazi is derived from the first two syllables of Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, the official German language name of the National Socialist German Workers’ Party “

            • bodo says:

              Sure, and the GDR was, in fact, a democratic republic, right? I mean, I’m from the US, so I’ll admit we got a distorted view of the “Iron Curtain” countries, but would you suggest (and I’m serious, because perhaps I’m significantly ignorant) that it was truly a democratic republic with fair voting and freedom of speech and freedom of the press and individual rights were considered important and such because of the name?

        • *looks at bag of hammers*
          *looks at foo*
          I’m not sure which is dumber, but I’m guessing foo.

        • rorschach says:

          Hitler took over the national socialist party and turned the party in a fascist direction, as any high school history student would know. Stalin also worked under the facade of communism, but considering that the working class was repressed even more than before the revolution, and Stalin’s friends lived in luxury most people of the time couldn’t imagine, he was closer to fascism than communism as well. and any real socialist would be insulted if you told them Obama was a socialist.

    • mothergoose says:

      You must be torn,

      should you shave your back, or learn to walk upright?

    • I’m torn too. Are you an ass fungus or an anal maggot? It’s so hard to tell.

  5. Lammassu says:

    LOL! “Hey at least Bush wasn’t as bad as Stalin!”

    That really says something about Bushie’s legacy doesn’t it?

    • n8 says:

      Came here to say this. If you’ve gotta reach back to Stalin to find somebody to make you look good, you’ve got big problems.

      • froofrou says:

        That reminds me of something Jon Stewart said recently…..(paraphrased) “When you have to start out by saying ‘hey, I’m not going to kill your granny!’, you’ve got problems.”

        Oh wait, that was about another person :-)

        • Jane St.Clair says:

          You keep watching the Daily Show and I’m going to revoke your Conservo-Card, missy.

        • Froo hates Obama! Froo iz teh conservotroll!!!!

        • Jay says:

          As it happens, the reason he has to say that is because certain conservatives keep perpetuating the “death panel” myth, and lots of easily frightened people buy into it. It ain’t in the bill, and when Betsy McCaughey – who first made the claim – went on the Daily Show to discuss, she made a fool of herself.

          She’s since been fired from her job at Cantel Medical Corp, which provides products to the healthcare industry. She was on the board of directors. Hello, conflict of interest!

  6. Sqwirk says:

    How did I get rated up!

  7. FrankiiDoodle says:

    I’m fairly sure that it was more than that, especially if you consider all the famine and stuff that was entirely his fault. But, you can’t argue with results

    • HelOnWheels says:

      It’s at least a few million more, especially if you count the forced Ukranian famine during which 3 million people died. It’s probably close to 25 million.

  8. common_sense says:

    This caption brought to you by Failblog.org

  9. Bear says:

    BTW, the site says LOL, not butthurt.

  10. Sqwirk says:

    It’s not Stalins fault that people starved.

    Do you all think there’s a “human right” to food or something?

    • Danbala says:

      He introduced the five year plans, though. I am not certain exactly how much they caused the starvation, but they sure were involved.

      • Sqwirk says:

        Seeing as how Russia became a superpower it’s pretty evident those people were a drag on the economy.

        At least they were made to do something productive unlike this generation of Americans who think they deserve healthcare.

        • Igloo McCoy says:

          I KNOW. All those poor people whining, “waah waah I have cancer and I can’t afford chemo, I’m going to lose my house” oh, quit your yapping. I didn’t get my trust fund OR my grandmother’s inheritance by whining about how it’s next to impossible to change class. Next time, be born into a rich family you bunch of deadbeats.

        • HelOnWheels says:

          You’re so incredibly wrong! Stalin forced the Ukrainian famine. How can you even begin to think that Ukraine, the bread basket of most of Europe, could not feed itself??!! Stalin took the majority of what was harvested from the farms. He forced people off land they’d been successfully working for generations. Three million people died in the Ukraine because of the famine. Not because of droughts or other natural disasters; because Stalin decided that he would conscript Ukrainian food production. Why don’t you do some research and stop downplaying one of the worst genocides in history, ignoramus.

          • Sqwirk says:

            And the English forced people off the land in the 18th century which started capitalism in the first place.

            That’s how it works. You can’t say it’s bad just because a “communist” does it. If Stalin had only opened up the economy after making the resources available we’d be seeing him as a hero today?

            Would america be where it is if the Indians were still wasting all the land?

            Is south america going to have growth or would china if those with capital aren’t allowed to move millions engaged in a low productive economy off ‘their’ land (if it was really theirs they’d have the means to keep it) and into factories?

            • Sqwirk says:

              And y’all criticise Bush but he was only doing the same thing.

              Iraq is now an open economy. The population has been trimmed down a couple of million and investment is starting.

              • You are seriously fvcked in the head, dude.

                • brak says:

                  I would suggest that our own economy is on the cusp and improvement will begin by leaps and bounds IMMEDIATELY with the subtraction of just one more individual. Hmmmm…..who should it be? Will he leave voluntarily or should we offer oh, say, N. Korea a deal?

            • HelOnWheels says:

              “And the English forced people off the land in the 18th century which started capitalism in the first place.”

              And you’re getting this information where?

              Stop stating that your opinion is fact.

              • viking gal says:

                I don’t know about ‘the start of capitalism’, but here is a link to the enclosure act on Wikipedia: where landowners fence off what had been commonly used land in order to raise sheep. Result: loss of grazing and crop-growing land for the tenants/peasants.

            • IvanTheMildlyAnnoying says:

              “Would america be where it is if the Indians were still wasting all the land?”

              THAT’S the comment that made my jaw drop. The mind boggles at this moron’s chutzpa. Yes Sqwirk. You are a moron.

          • ReligionIsDumb says:

            while the famines were definitely Stalin’s fault. I would first argue it was more incompetence than actual intent to produce genocide that created that situation. Second, where did all that food go?…it went to feed the rest of russia…which would have starved without that food. I don’t think he just went off and burned it. One way or the other 3 millions people were going to starve to death. Stalin chose that they be ukrainian. Third, Stalin did force people on to collective farms instead of their own personal farms, but this in-and-of itself, would not cause famine. The collective farms could produce just as much food as the personal farms, but the ukranian people got pissed at him taking their land and putting them in collective farms and refused to work. Thus, not enough food was produced to feed the whole soviet union and some people had to starve. Stalin chose ukraine, because he felt their refusing to work was the cause of the famine. I am not saying any of his decisions were right, but you are painting an inaccurate picture that makes it seem that stalin took away people’s food and land and then just burned it in order to kill ukrainians. That simply isn’t the case. It was a terrible thing that happened, but I don’t think it was his intent, at the outset, to kill 3 million ukrainians and nearly starve the entire soviet union.

            • HelOnWheels says:

              “you are painting an inaccurate picture that makes it seem that stalin took away people’s food and land and then just burned it in order to kill ukrainians. ”

              No, I don’t think that I was saying that at all. And that was not my intention. I wasn’t saying he was doing it intentionally to kill Ukrainians. And, yes, the famines were partially due to his incompetence and due to the fact that collective farms were not producing as much as independent farms etc.

              • ReligionIsDumb says:

                well, using the word genocide, IMO, implies intent rather than incompetence or political unrest was the cause of the millions of dead people. When you say genocide, I think of Hitler marching jews into concentration camps or african teenagers rounding up other african teenagers, marching them to big holes and putting a few clips of ak47 rounds into them. It also implies that the goal is the complete elimination of that ethnic group. I don’t think that was the case here either. Stalin’s incompetence and the unrest he created through unpopular authoritarian rule was ultimately responsible for the deaths of many people, but he didn’t “kill” them…nor was it genocide. That is where I feel that the caption, and your previous comments, go overboard.

        • Seriously, do you ever say anything even remotely intelligent? I think everyone in America should have health care. Except you. I also think everyone in America should have oxygen to breathe. Except you.

          • jinny_1909 says:

            So why should people who don’t give a crap get health care? Why should anyone who doesn’t work for something (not because they can’t, because they won’t) get anything?
            We need to reinstate the gene pool lifeguard, forget health care!

            • charro says:

              I agree with your statement about the gene pool lifeguard. But you can’t very well punish the people who DO do something just because of the few bad apples. Seems fascist to me..

        • I think all Americans deserve healthcare except you.

        • fergal the shark says:

          Yeah, and all those Australians, New Zealanders, Canadians and English people . . . you’re all lazy whingers who clearly have never done anything productive. How dare you be entitled to free health care.

      • mc says:

        Starvation was along in many regions. Like Poland and Czechoslovakia. many people died regardless Stalin or soviet plans.
        that was the last “natural starvation” in Europe , like many before. a 2-3 times a century a big hunger with millions of dead.
        But!
        It was not as dirty as starvation of Irishman initiated by England.
        Or starvation of British peasants eaten by sheep.
        Or starvation of Americans in Great Depression initiated by bankers. (wheat burned and drowned in order to hold price)
        At least Russian hunger was dreadful but not shameful as listed above.

        • paws4thot says:

          I am British, and I’d be really interested to know when British peasants were eater by sheep.

          The closest I can come is the “Highland Clearances” when thousands of small tennant farmers were semi-forcibly expariated to North America to free up their land for sheep farming, but that didn’t make the sheep into carnivores, or mean that the people were eaten!

    • Bear says:

      Wow, you’re stupid.

      I think I’ll go back to not reading the comments now.

    • Danbala says:

      I apologise for totally misreading this post.

  11. Sqwirk says:

    Who keeps rating me up!

  12. Sceptic says:

    Obviously Bush was not the worst world leader. He was definitely one of your worst presidents, however.

  13. AnuS says:

    american don’t who stalin was form. cause he was not on war with the usa.

  14. Guido says:

    Looks like Regan with a Groucho mustache.

  15. CarmenT says:

    I never noticed before that Ronald Reagan looked quite a bit like Stalin without the ’stache.
    (Not a political commentary here folks, just pure physical observation.)

  16. Sacl says:

    i he would just had kill a dog of a celebrity more people would know stalin.

  17. bodo says:

    I just don’t see why I should have to go all the way to Russia to see John Lennon’s tomb, I mean, it’s stupid – why would they bury him there when he wasn’t even Russian, right? Shouldn’t his tomb be in New York or Liverpool or…what? Oh, so Lenin was a different guy? Never mind then.

    • Adrimor says:

      I lol’d :D

      • HelOnWheels says:

        Yep, me too.

      • bodo says:

        Thank you both – I appreciate the feedback, and if I made even one person laugh that makes me feel better than anything I might’ve accomplished at work today…say, would either of you be up to sending a note to my corporate overlords masters…uh, my boss indicating that I’ve done something good? Recently?

        • bodo says:

          Ok, now I’m totally fascinated – did I offend anyone with my comments? It’s probably a value thing – I only vote against things (well, I haven’t actually yet) I think are offensive (if it doesn’t do anything for me I just move on). I’m curious as to how this comment (along with others) would strike someone as negative – I certainly don’t expect everyone to share my sense of humor, but I’m seriously curious (it won’t change me, unless it reveals some way I’m being mean/wrong/insulting etc. without meaning to) about what made someone vote this down? Likewise with my initial post – I meant it to make fun of ignorant folks, not Stalin or Lenin or Lennon – I don’t believe it’s disrespectful of anyone else, but I’d be honestly interested in hearing the reasons someone would vote a thumbs-down. My only agenda is to find out how I’m offending someone and correct that behavior on my part if necessary (and it doesn’t bother me so much as make me curious – honestly). I don’t care who it is/was – I’m just curious as to the reasoning behind it. Was it just because it wasn’t funny?

          • Jane St.Clair says:

            It’s impossible to go through life without offending anyone. Probably some lurker troll just wanted to be a douche.

            • bodo says:

              Agreed, but I figure it’s always good to check – I mean, if I’m offending someone, I want it to be on dolphin. Er, porpoise. Purpose! (sorry, get confused on that one sometimes)

    • Jane St.Clair says:

      And Georgia’s on my my my my my my my miiiiiiiiiiind.

    • Beware the Zombie Lennon threat on 09/09/09. You’ve been warned.

      • bitter troll says:

        zombie lemons?!?!?!?!?

        ZOMBIE LEMONAIDE!!!!!!

      • bodo says:

        Oooh, a flash Lennon-zombie thing, cool! Do we get to sing Back in the USSR? Will Paul be there?

        • bitter troll says:

          Ringo and george will be there, paul will not. john and george will open the show by eating ringo

          • bodo says:

            Will Keith Richards be there too? Oh crap, did I just out him? Damn…

            • bitter troll says:

              everyone knows keith and mick are zombies and have been since 1991..anyone acting shocked is either fakeing or just getting out of the basement

              • bodo says:

                Wait, you’re saying it’s possible to leave the basement? Seriously? I mean, you’re not just, ya know, messing with me here, right?

                • bitter troll says:

                  put down the plastic phazer….pull off the spock ears…take shower…exit basement…or incase you dont have basement shower…exit basement then take shower. go outside ( PUT ON CLOTHING FIRST ) sun is friend, good friend..bright and warm..meet girls..

                  • bodo says:

                    I…don’t wear…Spock ears…I wear the…toupee of leadership. And what is this shower thing you speak of? I think I’ve heard of girls – those are those things on the interwebs, right? That you chat with? That aren’t really hairy 40-year-old guys, no matter what anyone says?

                  • bodo says:

                    Ow. I mean, I’ve got all this skin (well, my face and arms and neck) that’s all red now and it hurts. Quote: “…sun is friend, good friend..bright and warm…”

                    Right.

                    And the girls didn’t react like on the interwebs AT ALL (well, except for that guy on the park bench, I mean, but he doesn’t count, right?), it was weird…

                    • viking gal says:

                      My sides hurt from laughing. I’m going to have to smite you two!

                      • bodo says:

                        Ha! Smite away! I’ve got my +2 blanket of….hold on…Dang!

                        Mommmm!1!!! Where’s my blanky!11! Are you washing it again! What did I tell you about that!1! And where’s my toupee!1!

        • *sigh* As everyone knows, John Lennon was obsessed with the number nine. So on 09/09/09 at 9:09 am (London time) he will rise from the grave and slaughter all those who don’t like the Beatles. There will be no escaping the Lennon Apocalypse. Oh, and Beatles Rockband comes out that day too.

          • bodo says:

            Damn, I was really hoping for the flash-zombie thing – oh well. At least I’m safe from Zombie-Lennon.

          • bodo says:

            And does it have to be London time? That’s like, 1:09am my time, and I’ll still have to get to work that morning – can we do it later, maybe?

          • bodo says:

            Crap! Was I supposed to bring the kool-aide or the min-vegi-sausages to the flash-zombie-lennon thing on the 9th? I lost my meeting minutes, dangit. And did we decide on Eastern Time?

  18. Amanda says:

    Way to to put things in perspective. ;)

  19. sisyphusredux says:

    For those of you actually interested in the numbers, google up “democide” or “power kills”.

    Interestingly enough, for all the Ameri-haters out there, the USA doesn’t even place.

    Go figure….

    • Sqwirk says:

      That’s unfair.

      America gets a better kill count if you’re allowed to figure in our overseas wars for freedom,
      clearance of indian squatters on productive land,
      deaths in the slave trade and count the civil war as a war of oppression (which it was against states rights).

    • herman ze german says:

      sorry to dissapoint you man …

      Native Americans 16th–19th Century 13,778,000
      Slavery of Africans 1451–1870 17,267,000

      most of the slaves were transportet to the usa and native americnas were rarely seen in continental europe and great britian.

      but we (ze germans) are only on place 3 … THAT was a surprise for me.

      • sisyphusredux says:

        Native Americans died from disease-they had no resistance to EUROPEAN/OLD WORLD diseases. The EUROPEAN colonists, at worst, killed less than 1% of the numbers you bruit about so recklessly.

        Slavery-there are NO numbers for this evil institution-therefore it’s not reasonable to include them. Besides, slaves were captured by other Africans and/or Arabs. European countries, most natably Portugal and Spain, encouraged and profited from the trade. Are they not complicit? Or do we just want to blame the evil capitalist Americans?

        Sorry-but I live to shake up Euro-misconceptions. You see, I’m married to one. And, my goodness, he does love America.

        Now.

        • Jane St.Clair says:

          The EUROPEAN colonists, at worst, killed less than 1% of the numbers you bruit about so recklessly.

          Where are you getting that number from, out of curiosity?

          • herman ze german says:

            well the numbers came from the homepage you mentoned. i just used your own sources against you. well even if only 1% of the people died of “lead”-poisoning and the other 99% of deseases, you could count it as biological warfare, because the americans took profit out of it.

            and about slaves … no market – no usefullness.

        • slan agat says:

          You’re married to a Euro-misconception? You must be a heavy-duty philosopher.

        • Bitter's Chef says:

          *High Fives Sisy*

          Anybody who likes shooting holes in euro-centric misconceptions of history rates high on my scale.

        • PortlandMark says:

          I’ll give you the point on slavery for free. Weird, but I agree with you for once.

          On disease, though, I think it’s important to note that Europeans actually encouraged the spread of disease by distributing blankets used by people who died of pox. I can’t absolve genocide just because it was accomplished through bio warfare instead of labor camps, toxic showers, and ovens.

          • bitter clown says:

            There is only one documented case of this ever happening intentionally and it was by Captain Eucyer of the British army. They did consider it according to some letters but worried about the effect it would have on their own men who were also susceptible to the disease. So, no bio warfare.

  20. hein says:

    Sadly, Stalin was a rank amateur compared to Mao who is responsible for over 100 million deaths during the so-called “Cultural Revolution.”

    • HelOnWheels says:

      I saw estimates that Mao was responsible for about 49 to 80 million. Not saying that’s any better than 100 million…

    • paws4thot says:

      Maybe not in raw numbers, but I’d suggest that in percentage of population kills, Pol Pot has got to be right up there with best of the best (worst of the worst?)

  21. Booty Mama says:

    OMFG! A lol that’s not from the Obama worshipping Liberals!!!

  22. ReligionIsDumb says:

    Hitler killed 35 million Russians (over half non-combatants)…compared to 6 million jews, but nobody ever talks about the Russian Holocaust. Another 5-10 million died from famine in Stalin’s time. Granted, though Stalin’s incompetence as a leader is partly responsible for all these deaths, he didn’t KILL 20 million people. He was a paranoid schitzo who though EVERYBODY was trying to kill him, and WE imprison a larger percentage of our population than he did. Given how big a role incompetence played in the casualties of Stalin’s regime, imagine how much worse it would have been with Bush in charge. Hitler would have been in Moscow before Bush put “мая коза” down and managed to stammer out a nearly incoherent and, of course, useless order.

    • HelOnWheels says:

      “nobody ever talks about the Russian Holocaust”

      That’s because most don’t know about it.

      • ReligionIsDumb says:

        35 million people was a good chunk of the russian population at that time. I don’t know what the pop was in the 1930s, but today, that would be over 10% of the population. It could have been as much as 30% of the population that was lost during that time. To many in Russia, the mere fact that Stalin won that war, redeems him of his many faults. That is why, to this day, many still think Stalin was a good leader. 35% of russians would VOTE for him. WWII had a PROFOUND impact on Russian culture and continues to have one even today. Their entire population was nearly wiped out and nobody in the west gave a crap because they were the “evil empire”. There is some point at which one must stop demonizing one’s political enemies and develop some compassion and humanity.

        Sorry for ranting, but this issue hits close to home for me…although I am not Russian.

        • viking gal says:

          For what it is worth, I actually was aware of the Stalin’s slaughter and starvation of his people…but I learned of it from my mother, not from school. It would have been current events when my mother was in diapers, which is probably relevant.

          • Bitter's Chef says:

            VG – Yeah, it’s too bad that history education is so weak here in the west.

            Even though I didn’t have many sixties-era graduates as teachers when I was finishing up school in the seventies, I always thought my history education was thin, . . . until I started, listening to my younger siblings and nieces/nephews who went through school in the eighties and nineties. To borrow a phrase, it’s not that they’re ignorant; it’s just that they know so much that isn’t so.

            I consider myself lucky to have grown up in communities around Detroit and Toronto amongst many elderly immigrants from Eastern Europe. It was quite enlightening to hear their life experiences after having been taught the PC version of history in school.

            • Igloo McCoy says:

              What’s weird is that every kid from the second they can talk knows about Hitler. Most kids probably know a little about the USSR but have no idea about what really transpired. And no one knows about the Cambodian genocide….

        • HelOnWheels says:

          yeah, not sure why you started ranting at me for pointing out that most people don’t know about the Russian Holocaust but hope you’re feeling better now.

  23. Rae says:

    I don’t think the comparison applies. Stalin did kill 20 million of his own people…so is Bush better because he’s (so far) only killed 4000 U.S. soldiers and 10,000+ Iraqi civilians?

    • Danbala says:

      I think it’s more like 100,000ish Iraqi civilians. The numbers vary according to source, but I think it’s generally agreed that they are well over 50,000.

      And… Well, “better” is a strange word in the context. Less bad, certainly.

    • sisyphusredux says:

      Why, yes.

      Why do you ask such a phenomenally silly question?

    • LirrenShentai says:

      How has he “killed” 4000 soldiers? For sending them to war? People DIE IN WAR. Get it through your kleenex carrying weepy-eyed thick skulls. And…wait for it…we are at war! Shocker, isn’t it?

      • bitter troll says:

        according to fox news its only7 iraqi civilians…and they where more then happy to die for freedom..

      • Clairissa says:

        That’s not the point. The point is that if you volunteer to be in the army, and everyone in the American army did, you have signed on to go to war whether you believe in said war or not. If you didn’t think the college tuition was worth the risk of death, you shouldn’t have joined the army. But if you did join, you knew what you were getting into. And if you didn’t know, it’s your own fault.

        • Sigma says:

          It’s rather strange how so many solders react the way they do when they get ’stop-loss’ or whine and gripe about how the job sucks so bad. There was an old army veteran who talked about how two solders volunteered to go into the new airborne program, but they were rejected due to physical or medical disadvantages. They hanged themselves. Two young men took their own lives because they could not go the distance to serve their country in an elite unit. It’s quite the opposite now, as testosterone driven jocks or stupid ‘intellectuals’ gripe about something they signed up for with their own free will, since there is no draft anymore. People these days have lost touch.

          • Stephanie says:

            Perhaps if the army did not constantly seek to recruit from lower class areas, promising health care and college tuition for just a few years service. Not everyone who joined the armed forces joined when we were at war. They were just offered a way out of poverty and a way to pay medical bills.

            Wait… Lower class kids who feel their only option is the military because… Oh, suddenly I understand why absolutely no health care reform is going on from either side.

  24. Ms. Valit says:

    uh, i don’t think they usually say Bush is “worst world leader” ever, but more like “worst [US] president” ever.
    personally, i’m not sure if i would rank Bush (43) as the worst US Pres ever, because there’s a number of past presidents i know little to nothing about. One of my political-science-major friends ranked what he thought were the USA’s 5 worst presidents, and his pick for the very worst was Bush-43, but the others i knew very little about…except that Nixon may have been one of them, and i am aware of what the huge spot on his record is.

  25. Nailin Pailin says:

    Ask a Young Republican and he’ll say Obama is the worst leader ever.

    • Dhoti says:

      Just the young ones?

    • Semperfidd says:

      and he would be correct. Tell him what he won Johnny. In all seriousness, I don’t think you could put Obama in that category yet as he still has many more years to go. I personally believe he is heading for that title if he continues going in the direction he has chosen but I think things can and will change over the course of his years in the presidency as the congress will fear for their jobs and will move more back to what I consider the center.

      • froofrou says:

        Now now, Semper, remember, Obama is merely God’s partner. I wonder if he’s top or bottom….

      • slan agat says:

        This just tells me you wouldn’t know the center if it came up and kissed you on the mouth.

        When every other country in the industrialized world has some form of government financed single payor health care, where we are is not the center, it’s way the hell over to the right. Having a public plan competing and keeping the privates honest – not taking them over and putting them out of business – might be something resembling the center.

        • paws4thot says:

          That’s certainly closer to centrist.

          For example, in the UK we have free at point of use and immediate critical and emergency health care for all, irrespective of whether or not you have additional health insurance to handle electives. We also have prescription drugs prices to the consumer (other than odd private prescriptions) regulated to a fairly affordable level, something like about 1.5 hours work on minimum wage, and that’s if you’re not in an exempt group who get prescription meds free, like anyone still in High School or younger, anyone over 65, pregnant women…

  26. cheese puff says:

    Um no? Sorry, but most of the college students I know aren’t ignorant dolts. Bush was a horrible president, but nobody I know is saying he’s worse than Stalin.

  27. wordaddict says:

    Uuum….I doubt the truth of this caption, like a lot, but whatevs.

    There’s always someone bitching about how few conservative lols there are around here. Maybe if they were actually FUNNY…

  28. LirrenShentai says:

    Finally. Some truth!

  29. bitter troll says:

    this guy tom sellick?
    from magnum p i show?

  30. 1984 says:

    Most would probably name Titler…

  31. jl5691426 says:

    RNC propaganda fail.

  32. Bill says:

    I diss aggree completely with President Obama but my God says he will give us the leaders we deserve and to pray for them. Please show the office and a man approved by God to serve his will,just as Pharo served Gods Purpose and will and when God said let my people go he did. Pray for Jesus Christ judgement on our country and the church and to lead us back to a nation under God. William Penn said the Nation that is not goverened by God will be ruled by Tyrants Bill

  33. Marekatt says:

    “World leader”? Wow, you really ARE arrogant over there. You seriously think the US is “the world”? Staling was never a “world leader” either. Ghengis Kahn, Ceasar, Alexander the Great: THOSE WERE “WORLD” LEADERS. Stalin was a dictator and a tyrant, bush was a puppet (and you can’t estimate the count of deaths he caused till the wars he started are over. There might still go off a nuclear bomb somewhere and kill millions).

  34. Sqwirk says:

    I think it’s time for a president with facial hair.

  35. Kelly says:

    well he was definitely the worst american leader, but liberals and conservatives alike tend to only think about their own country when thinking about the worst and the best. it´s really arrogant of us.

    • bitter troll says:

      bitter troll politely disagrees

      andrew jackson biggest weenie president ever

      trail of tears

      married hooker in office

      list goes longer but me lazy

      • viking gal says:

        AJ’s inauguration party trashed the White House, & he fought a duel while in office. Small beans compared to the trail of tears, but a scandal at the time.

      • Micky says:

        Dude, Bitter Troll…It’s amazing you’ve got the most salient point on this entire commentary page.

        You rock!

        Let’s see the polls on ‘worsts’ in 100 years!

  36. Anniee451 says:

    Amazing that this made it to the front page. I favorited it immediately.

  37. Ben says:

    If worst is = to ineffectual, then YES bush is the winner. you know how hard it is to kill 20 million people?!

  38. lolbot says:

    You’re all fighting on a website forum. LoL!

    Hilarity ensues.

  39. dead man walking says:

    Apparently, the less people you kill, the more people talk about you.

  40. obama worse than stalin i win.

    now all the odipshit lovers and
    bush haters stfu and gtfo.

    odipshit is just a whiny ass loser
    who uses bush as a scapegoat and
    blames all his troubles on him.

    darkie blaming whitey even in the
    white house, go firgure.

  41. Chris says:

    The sad thing is how true this statement is…

    I have asked a lot of people on my campus this question and they all say the last administration was the worst ever…

    Riiiiiiight….

    Morons.

    Look at the current one. Has anyone seen approval numbers drop this fast?

    • IvanTheMildlyAnnoying says:

      Actually, his overall approval rating hasn’t dropped much at all;

      {http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_obama_job_approval-1044.html}

      What has dropped is the approval rating on what he is doing with the health care thing;

      {http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/polls/postpoll_072009.html}

    • subtlefuge says:

      Gee, I didn’t know Stalin was once a US president.

  42. Azkyroth says:

    Under Stalin, Russia did most of the work defeating Hitler’s Germany. Bush couldn’t even win a war he started with a much weaker country for trumped-up reasons.

  43. Russian says:

    Just compare what Americans did to the natives and what Stalin did to the natives. Not to mention people who died in Iraq because of American sanctions.

  44. pookid says:

    This is SO dumb. Number one, Bush is said to be the worst “president”, not leader. And number two, Bush could NEVER be called a “leader” using any dictionary.

  45. Aha says:

    SUPER MARIO HELLSHINE!!!!

  46. AsdBap says:

    “World Leader”? is that like a American “World champion”?

  47. Erik says:

    Bad lol, since most college students might see it as more important to deal with the present, rather than whining about past already lost.

  48. lolbot says:

    You losers are still fighting!

    LoL! Everyone is a winner!

  49. Morgan says:

    Derp derp Bush saved America.

  50. KatrineW says:

    “You’ve killed over 20 million people? You must get up very early in the morning!”

    I <3 Eddie Izzard…. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Edp02HyBqrY

  51. Cosman246 says:

    But Bush was worse!

  52. JimmyValentine says:

    20 million? Come on! Everyone knows he shot at least a billion. Personally.
    Also, Stalin ate babies.

  53. Ceefax says:

    This might have been more relevant a few years ago, considering at the moment it’s Obama that people are saying is worse than Hitler and Stalin. (Click my name for one of them getting absolutely owned)

  54. tankrunner1123 says:

    Godwins Law Cat is not amused

  55. philip says:

    Actually, it was more like 40 million. And that’s without counting the ones which died because of bad policies, directly caused by Stalinistic worldviews. (for example, Stalin was a Lamarckist, so he made his farmers sow summer-only crops in winter, so they would become winter crops. As a result, the harvests failed and people starved to death).

    There was one thing that Bush did which Stalin didn’t do worse: Bush got his country in less debt. And that’s because Stalin outlawed currency.

    In short, this is completely true. (and for the record, I’m socialist.)

  56. Stormy says:

    Yes, because as we all know, people claim that Bush is worse than Stalin.

    Oh…wait…they don’t.

    This LOL fails, badly. Typical neo-con BS.

  57. Charlie says:

    You know what’s great about Former-President Bush? That we can hate him. Imagine North Korea where you’re FORCED to like the leader, and if you say anything bad, they’ll kill you.

  58. wichser says:

    he wasn’t a russian he was a georgian

    • mc says:

      >>he wasn’t a russian he was a georgian

      Ossetian moved to Georgia but still russian )))
      think you will not get it right )

      • mc says:

        speaking of numbers.
        may I educate you a little? ))
        there were 900k of killed in Gulag in period of 30 years. (20m is a total bs)
        that’s 30k per year.
        now in modern Russia there is 40k killed in traffic accidents, 40k of vodka every year. 60k of drugs and AIDS and other shit that we got with ‘democracy’!
        and population overall is decreasing per 1M year for almost 20 years of ‘democracy’. after WWll we got 100M increase of population in 45 years. This is how Stalin was bad!
        so. I’d better prefer Stalin!
        but with internet, HD and bittorents of course )

        • paws4thot says:

          So there was no road traffic, and no alcohol abuse, in the USSR? Perhaps you should try and find out what the comparable figures for, say, 1965 (random year at height of Cold War) were?

          • mc says:

            Much less traffic and alcohol compared to nowadays.
            almost no personal transport! but good public transport system.
            Production of truck was about production of automobiles. in 65 there was triumph of nation and many goals ahead – no need to drink vodka.
            in late USSR there was anti-alcohol laws like in 30s in America. reached a goal I should say. but with crash of country too many people loose their goal in life and go back to vodka. thats how true genocide began!

            • paws4thot says:

              I don’t have figures off-hand for alcohol abuse, but your RTA stats are high but not outrageously so for a developed World nation. I’d also suggest that they’ll come down as more people get more used to having private transportation available to them.

              • mc says:

                Im not talking about stats.
                the point is killing 30k bad guys per year is not a bad idea, more now just die in traffic without a reason. If population is growing and you get rid of a trash. Chinese can kill drug dealers and consumers. they can kill 1M per year and they still will be growing. Its Chinese matter who to kill in there country and I cannot blame them.
                Why blame Stalin for that? In face of war get rid of “fifth column” and unite nation is a good decision.
                Myths of 20M killed own people is a western propaganda. It’s a part of anticommi propaganda which is part of Russophobic propaganda. Russophobic propaganda lasts for centuries and will last further. It’s a key stone of western culture – they get it with mother milk, they read it in comics, they study it in Universities. So finally they cannot stay without brains washed. If you see “20M own people killed” – bingo! You just figure another brain washed.
                I cant say this is surprising. It’s a common practice – take a nation or civilization(I guess Russians are a civilization not a nation) and draw a bloody stupid barbarian. That’s how you can manipulate your crowd. Once Europeans draw barbarians of Arabs in order to sake them ) But at that time they themselves where barbarians compared to Arabs – no culture, no science.
                Now the same trick is applied to Russians – to sake them as well )
                But with new methods! Finances and democracy will drink oil and other recourses as blood from dead body of USSR.

  59. mc says:

    I should add good and free education (I graduate russian MIT for free), healthcare, no freaking mortages – you just work and get a flat.
    good morale of “Builders of communism”.
    much less criminal. good families and growth of population (about 100M after WWll)
    this is not words – this is achivements of high developed society which served to frighten to death western nations to make them pay to corporations and the rest )
    Bloody Stalin started it. Democratic Gorbachev and Yelcin finiched. thats the story now )

  60. ogre says:

    That’s okay, Uncle Joe…In a few more months people will have forgotten ALLLLL about Bush. ;-)

  61. Nasha says:

    i could be wrong but do I spot a massive fail on Stalins first name below the pic? hmmmm batman returns with the big failmobile.

  62. Dargus says:

    How many Native Americans did the “real” Americans kill? Did we beat Communist Russia? Nazi Germany?

    In terms of numbers, I’m thinking we beat the holocaust hands-down. Feel free to correct me, though.

    Does anyone know how close we got to Stalin’s “20 million” killed?

    For some reason I’m remembering the numbers to be around 80-90 million Native Americans dead as a direct/indirect result of our invasion. I can’t back that up though.

    Go America. We are the best.

    • Ichi says:

      They assimilated.

    • Holger says:

      The 80-90 million is with the effects of Small pox being introduced as well as Alcohol. You can’t really blame both on us. Small Pox is a natural killer and substances similar to Aclohol is found in all cultures.

      We are even, they gave us tobacco!

  63. Krynn-Meridia says:

    Word to this.

    President Bush was <3.

  64. Nancy says:

    This IS funny, but also sooo very true. THAT part is not funny.

  65. Ichi says:

    Twenty million? You’re quite a few million off. Think in the 43 million range

  66. premiermois says:

    Bush was simply an idiot. Stalin, however, was not – and look what he did.

    Now imagine if Bush only had the intelligence of some of the world’s worst people.

  67. mike-n-tn says:

    Most of you kids are complete idiots. Chowing down on the main stream media feed and chasing it with huge gulps of the Democrat koolaid.
    You think Bush is an idiot simply because “they” told you to think that… made it cool to believe that, even.
    Meanwhile, Obama is a complete, marxist waste of flesh, but “oh no” – He’s so cool and I’m just a racist. *sigh*
    Good Bye America.

  68. Butmunch says:

    It was actually more like 50 million, plus all the people that were put in gulags and concentration camps and all the people that starved to death.


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