$4 gas?
$4 gas? Mortgage crisis? When I was a prisoner in ‘Nam…
(John McCain)
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ok, this is probably the worst one so far.
also, i bet someone made something like this with Obama, (thats right John, or i brought a bracelet, too) but it got downvoted into oblivion.
you cant say anything negative about the messiah… thats blasphemy!
The family of Ryan Jopek had asked Obama to stop wearing that bracelet!
The father does a lot of speaking on behalf of his ex-wife – maybe people should actually ask her what she said to Obama?
Anyway, how’s Palin doing, pet? Still excited about the appointment?
Conservative bloggers are jumping ship on Palin after her recent interviews.
Liberal bloggers are slicing their throats after the debates.
Nope, try again.
Liberal bloggers would have proclaimed an Obama victory if he showed up and couldn’t talk because he lost his voice on the campaign trail, so I doub’t they were cutting their own throats.
That’s probably true, but only because he could still beat McCain without using his voice.
See what I mean? This guy is the perfect example. He probably thinks there was a “winner” in the debate, even though it was a couple idiots preaching to their respective choirs.
AMERICAN. POLITICS.
How much more freakin’ explanation is needed?
Bitter much? They both spouted a lot of talking points, true. But I watched the debate, and I thought they both made good points (in terms of presentation and command of facts, not content. In terms of content, well, I’m not a neo-con, so McCains points fell flat with me.)
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You, sir, would have lost to either of them in a debate.
And committing suicide on the gates of Baghdad, eh Bob?
Did you even watch the debate? Sorry, read the polls. Win for Obama. Mind you, I thought McCain did better than expected. But I expected a frightened old man, based on his pre-debate behavior. McCain did better on the economy than I thought he would, and Obama was too nice, but no one is calling it a win for McCain except for a few conservative idiots.
McCain wiped the floor with Obama. They say Obama “won” because he was the underdog and it came to somewhat of a tie (because McCain didn’t start the floor wiping til the end) but really Obama just failed.
You know, usually to “wipe the floor” with someone, you have to at least look them in the eye first.
Everyone else disagrees with you. FAIL.
This is the best political counter arguement ever.
The mom did give him the bracelet and her only public statement has been in favor of Obama wearing it and talking about it.
The father, who is divorced from the mom, and doesn’t speak for her, disapproves.
Nice that the mom supports Obama enough to give him that bracelet to wear, too bad Obama can’t even remember the sons name.
Echo chamber fail.
He remembered the name; his stumble was on who presented the bracelet. He’d begun to say that the (deceased) Sargent gave him– the mother of the Sargent gave him…
Please, he looked at the bracelet to read the name, which he had forgotten. It was so obvious.
So it’s completely improbable that he looked at the bracelet to (a) see if was wearing it, (b) jog his memory of the occasion, or (c) reflect on the words of the mother? The only reason he looked at the bracelet is that he didn’t know the name?
Let’s assume that’s true, for the sake of argument. Wouldn’t that just go to show that he wasn’t planning on using a dead soldier to make a point?
didn’t look right to me
How d’ya feel about Palin’s appointment, ema?
If he had to look at the bracelet to see if he was wearing it, then that is an even bigger FAIL on his part.
Some things should make a big enough impact on you you don’t ever forget. Period.
The AP is reporting that the mother is “ecstatic” that Obama mentioned him. She said it was appropriate.
http://www.nbc15.com/state/headlines/29864149.html
Gee, it’s crazy the kind of shit you learn when you read, you know, CREDIBLE news sources.
Ema … that is a lie. The mother of Ryan Jopek has spoken out against internet bloggers that are saying this. She had asked that her son not be mentioned in speeches but she is happy that Obama told the world that there IS another viewpoint on the war and she understood that he had to mention the bracelet to do that. She is honored that he was wearing the bracelet and she was happy that he made it clear that NO soldier dies in vain but that some people want the war to end before more families are destroyed by it.
I was insulted when McCain tried to drag that mother into the argument. “We gotta get more kids killed ’cause otherwise the ones that are already dead died for nothing!” Obama seemed rightfully pissed, and I’m glad he responded to McCain. It needs to be said: some gold star mothers want more dead soldiers to join their children; others would like for no other mother to endure what they endured.
Maybe their children shouldn’t have signed up for the military. I can’t decide if its a good thing or a bad thing that people sign up for the military expecting a few years of menial duty somewhere and then a free ride to college, and then are totally shocked when a war rolls around.
Hopefully the current conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan will teach potential soldiers that there is a good chance they could be injured or killed, and to think about that before they sign up.
Then again, no one ever speaks for the dead soldiers. All we ever hear is some parent who is upset they lost their child. I really don’t like the portrayal of our soldiers as some kind of victims who got dragged out of their homes and thrown into a warzone. These are volunteers who either joined because they believed in something, or because they gambled that they wouldn’t see combat. I don’t mean to be callous, but grieving parents aren’t exactly the most objective people in the world.
Don’t worry, McCain agrees that the free ride to college should be a lot harder to come by. He consistently votes against the GI bills
I agree, military members should not be surprised that as a member of the military they might get sent over seas to fight in the defense or interests of the united states however being sent to fight and die in a war that was likely unnecessary, and unjust is a different matter entirely.
Yeah the fact is, people in war die, that is an aspect of war that I think most people tend to dislike however it still doesn’t mean they should die or expect to die just because they believe in serving in our countries defense.
And some of them were practically dragged out of their homes. I don’t think many members of the national guard expected to be sent to Iraq. I’m sure they served those tour with honor and it wasn’t necessary to literally drag them out of their homes but the guard is generally reserved for domestic emergencies and support and can only be called to active duty by the president.
Keep on whining, that’ll turn things around! You must be so proud to back a candidate who is such a wuss that he can’t even look his opponent in the eye.
I guess you didn’t see the beginning of the debate when they walked out and McCain greeted and looked Obama in the eyes. Honestly after that, looking at your oponent is not the best thing to do. At a debate you are there to interact with the audiance, not make “bedroom eyes with the ‘Messiah’” (But that could be me “clinging to my religion and guns”).
If you look at the pictures taken of that handshake, you’ll see that McCain is studiously avoiding eye contact. He’s looking past Obama. In this, I see two possibilities. McCain is either so ashamed of selling out his honor so many times to get where he is now, or he’s a racist who won’t give the “darkie” the honor of a straight look in the eye.
Wow…you have to dig really deep into your own bigotry to make those wonderful statements. The problem with photos is they dont always give 100% of the information (they are only a moment in the event). Check the video at Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-nNIEduEOw (from 1 minute 30 seconds to 1 minute 45 seconds). You can see the full meeting between them.
He needs to quit pointing it out, or more people will figure out that his PTSD makes him unfit to be president. We wouldn’t want that.
If you doubt it, you can read about it at http://www.usvetdsp.com/dec07/mccain_suicide_ptsd.htm
Oh No! He had PTSD! Wait many (if not most) Vietnam veterans had PTSD (as do many Iragi vets) which was many times excascerbated by public opinion at the time. You will notice at the end of the article it also talks about when faced with the man responsible with his torture and interrogation he didnt flip out and attack him… he was actually friendly (maybe overly). PTSD is a fairly commonly diagnosed symptom to traumatic events, including traffic accidents, fires, ect. The question is did he recover from it as many do, did he commit suicide, or does he still suffer from it (it appears he has recovered from it pretty well since he leads an active and rather stressful life).
But McCain doesn’t support healthcare for treatment of PTSD for our veterans. He consistently votes against everything that grants better benefits to Veterans
A+.
Don’t forget about Normandy.
Speech patterns:
You’re view on the economy?
McCain: When I was in Vietnam, my friends…
Obama: Hope, change, the hope of change…
So true. They both sound like useless broken records.
“Hope ! Change!” repeat ad nauseum….
“‘Nam! POW! Maverick!”
B..b..but he doesn’t -understaaaaaand!!!-
in bed
Much as i respect POWs and veterans, McCain is honestly doing nothing but playing the SAME card Giuliani did.
NINE ELEVEN
And yes, i know Obama does the same with hope and change and stuff like that.
But never forget… socialism is a change from our current economy so obama isnt lying by any means LOL… hes a communist and needs to be shot honestly.
You’re an idiot and while you don’t need to be shot, a good slap upside the head might do you some good.
I could have sworn that EP said only liberals were so violent and hate filled.
Nope. Just that liberals are far more violent.
Liberal says ‘I wish he would die’ (or something similar, it’s been awhile since a liberal said something like this)
EP says ‘There’s that liberal hate/violence’
Conservative says ‘he… needs to be shot’
EP is nowhere to be seen
Maybe he’s working to support millions on welfare.
Vote Republican: Because only multi-billion dollar corporations deserve welfare.
You’re working off the assumption that all Republicans support this bailout. This is one of the most liberal things I have ever seen a Republican do, and I’m so against it that I’m almost back around to supporting it again. *sigh* That pooch is yelping because it’s being screwed over and over. Trust me, Republicans as a whole don’t agree with this bailout.
Most progressives hate this bailout, too.
I’m speaking to the broader history of Republicans supporting welfare for corporations and not people. Moreso, I’m sick seeing that sort of sentiment (work harder: millions on welfare depend on you!). Having actually been on welfare — well, having been the son of a single mother on welfare — I know the reality of the experience. It’s not a hand-out. It’s not even a decent livable income. It’s a supplement, and a shitty supplement at that.
But hey! It’s not you who’s suffering, so fuck ‘em! You’ll never be in a position of need; you’ll never have the bottom fall out on your life. Live it up and piss on the poor; it’s what Jesus would do!
*Rhetorical “you”.
You tell ‘em, comrade !
Been there too Herb, Don’t know which of us had it worse, but at least to some extent, I know how you feel.
It’s not like business doesn’t provide anything back to society in the way of jobs and investments and if this bailout can keep people from losing their savings and retirement accounts or even their jobs then it really will end up helping everyone. I hate the idea of the bailout too, but it is actually an investment that will hopefully pay off. If it does pay off we will get the money returned with interest, we can hope for the best.
Helping the little guy provides more back to the economy. This whole economic problem happened because rich people didn’t want to invest their money in new job creation. That’s what happens when you try to drive the economy from the top. If you help the little guy instead, he buys things, and rich people invest in new jobs to create all the new things the little guys are buying. Trickle down economics (or ‘voodoo economics’ as Bush, Sr. called it) has been disproven so many times, it isn’t funny that Republicans still think it’s a good idea. But they know it doesn’t really work. It’s just welfare for their friends.
He buys things from who Seth? Who does the little guy buy “things” from? It’s from businesses that provide jobs and innovation to the community. Government just doesn’t provide that kind of innovation. They aren’t all bad boogey man evil corporations. They are run by people, people just like the “little guy” you want to defend. Why demonize them?
(Replying to Ema, who seems to have something against ‘nesting’
Who buys all the stuff that the fat cats invest in creating? The regular citizens of America. If they have no money, there is no reason to invest in creating new businesses. And the only way for them to get money, is to have jobs, right? So if people don’t have jobs, with which to make money, with which to buy things, the rich won’t invest in businesses, they will create ridiculous gambling systems basd on a real estate game of chicken. That is what actually happened.
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If, instead of giving breaks to the rich, who can always just sit on their money, because they already have their yachts, mansions, and trophy wives, you give the breaks to the little guy, then the fat cats have no choice. Investing in jobs suddenly looks good to them. You can argue all you like, but the facts show that trickle down economics doesn’t work. The facts have showed that for years, take off your ideological blinders and look at those facts.
I guess your going to blame the lack of nesting on me now!
Won’t that work for richer people too? Keep more money in their hands and they will go out and buy that new yacht? Which will help the companies that build yachts and the people that work for them? Rich people need to buy things too. Won’t that help create jobs?
As much as I hate the concept of this bailout, everyone waited so long to do anything about it that it is now the lesser of two evils…
He’s out getting an entire program re-boot.
EP is wishing he had the cojones to say something like that.
I’ll give you a dollar if you actually know what socialism really is, and how it differs from a well regulated capitalist system. I’ll give you another dollar if you can explain to me why, when the happiest nations in the world have well regulated capitalist systems, we wouldn’t want to look into seeing what it is they do better than we do.
shinobi’s the type that throws around big words they don’t understand in the hope that something sticks. Amusingly pathetic or pathetically amusing?
The main difference between socialism and capitalism is that socialism is a administrative policy and capitalism is an economy policy. Comparing the two is mosre like comparing apples and oranges. If you want something to compare to capitalism , try communism, which is also merely an economy policy. The opposite to socialism would be personalism if you cared to know.
And yet, the right wing of the Republican party continues to present socialism as the opposite of capitalism. It stems from a fundamental limitation in their world view; for them, everything is a duality. Everything is either This or it is That. There is no room for something that has qualities of both This AND That, or worse, something that is This, That, and Something Else. (Sorry for the meta syntactic variables there)
Do you know what the hell you’re talking about and what MY point is?
i just want them to stop blabbering and start doing.
It’s funny that McCain wanted to stop his campaign to help with the when, last i checked, he wasn’t on any sort of economic committee to begin with. But at the same time, i want these fools to actually try and help get this bill moving and signed. If that means canceling a debate, so be it, but rather they do it as SENATORS elected by their state than as presidential candidates!!!
… We had to walk uphill and go break rocks. Both ways! *waves cane*
get off my lawn
Damn kids…
Oh, good, thanks, I had almost forgotten McCain was a POW.
I find this offensive. Yes John McCain reminds us of his service and sacrifice. The entire McCain family has a history of service. After serving as an Admiral in the US Navy for duration of World War II, his grandfather died of a heart attack within a week of the Japanese surrender, brought on by total exhaustion. His father served as well during World War II, reaching the rank of admiral as well. With all the power of his position, he had to watch his son suffer the captivity and mistreatment for five years. A difficult thing for any father. John McCain has been raised on the premise that you should do your duty for your country. I know that some of you will never accept or understand this, but we have been fortunate to have such men throughout our history. The fact that he stayed there in Hanoi with his men when he could have come home should tell you all you need to know about the kind of man John McCain is. I believe such a person will always try to do what he feels is right for this country. He takes the long view, not always the immediate what is he going to promise me.
and John mCcain also supported all the bills which caused the 700billion bail-out face John McCain sucks, he turns on everything that goes wrong and always changes everything he says or says he will do, at least obama plans to stick with one thing or the other
You have no proof of that because Obama himself has no proof of it. You can’t vote “present” in the White House. You actually have to make a decision, be it good or bad.
FDR voted present. Then Eleanor took over from there. Polio in the midst of sexism sure does suck.
Having Michelle Obama in charge actually sends cold chills up my spine.
Scared of a smart, educated black woman? Girl please!
The Democrats were scared of a smart, educated white woman too.
At least the Democrats _had_ a smart, educated white woman.
Are you talking about us?
He certainly isn’t talking about me!
Shut yo asses up, Be-yotches and put your burkhas back on !
At least it’s better than changing your opinion whenever the polls turn out different.
McCain has many times simply waited to give his opinion until the polls showed him which way to lean, which is akin to the same thing.
McCain changed his mind on the economy in a 2 hour span, lololol.
McCain’s been warning for *years* that this was coming and was ignored.
Obama hasn’t stuck with *anything* ever. Well other than his socialist dogma.
Yeah, Obama ran off on his first wife in order to marry a heiress! Oh wait.
Sorry escape, but we don’t know that. If history has taught us anything it’s that most of what every Presidential candidate promises never comes to pass.
“With all the power of his position, he had to watch his son suffer the captivity and mistreatment for five years.”
So, in your few, since he was powerful, he should have been able to keep his son out of that situation (a la Bush), and let someone less powerful’s son rot in a POW camp? That sounds pretty Elitist to me, no wonder you are backing McCain.
No, that is not what I ment at all. Obviously you are unable to understand the concept of “Noblesse oblige”. This is something men like John McCain and his family understand quite well. With wealth, power and prestige come responsibilities. There was no chance that his father would use his position to get his son out. I t does not mean as a father, he was not affected. Every parent wants thing to be better for their children than it was for them. Your post indicates that you are an immature, self important narcissist that professes to care for others, but has no concept of what that really means. Go out and do something important for someone else, then you might understand.
Wow, professing to psychoanalyze me with just a few sentences of input (and getting it completely wrong in the process to boot)? Impressive. I am well familiar with the concept, hence my derogatory statements toward people who abuse their wealth and position to protect their own children while sending the children of the less affluent off to fight wars. “There was no chance that his father would use his position to get his son out.” How freaking naive are you? That was quite a common practice among the wealthy and powerful at the time. Who are you to say there was no chance of McCain taking advantage of it? You say that every parent wants a better life for their children. Logic dictates that part of that would be hoping to prevent them from having to fight in a war. As for your original statement that I quoted, I stand by what i said. The power of his position was irrelevant to the level of his suffering. The only place that power would be relevant would have been in keeping McCain out of Nam in the first place. As for your pathetic personal attacks against me, I won’t even justify those with a further response.
“John McCain has been raised on the premise that you should do your duty for your country. I know that some of you will never accept or understand this, but we have been fortunate to have such men throughout our history.”
No one is dogging McCain for serving his country. No one is calling him a bad person for being in the military. No one is insulting his father or grandfather. Everyone thanks John McCain for his service and what he did for the country. But can we move on? Being a POW does nothing for credentials for economic policy. Having served in the military doesn’t mean that you understand how drilling for oil works.
And the same holds true for Obama. From listening to both campaigns, no one is against changing the way things are currently headed. No one wants to step on anyone who hopes for a better life for their children or other people’s posterity. But lecturing on Constitutional law doesn’t mean that you know how to solve the mortgage crisis. Registering voters doesn’t mean that you are an expert on foreign policy.
And just for the record, there are other ways to fulfill your duty to your country that doesn’t include military service. And saying that just because you haven’t served means that one can’t understand or accept McCain’s service is rude and belittling. Because again, there are other ways to fulfill your duty that doesn’t include military service, especially since we have a voluntary service.
Maybe a little support of the veterans and troops would make us respect his sacrifice more.
You would think that given what he has endured he would be on the frontlines championing veteran’s care. He isn’t. His voting record is one of the WORST in the senate when it comes to helping his brothers in arms.
If you support our troops and our veterans you SHOULD be supporting Obama – he at least cares about them as more than a photo op.
Where the hell is gas only $4? It’s $4.79 in my city…AFTER it dropped from $5.19.
$3.58 here….
Never went over $4 here. Got to $3.99 for a bit, but backed off.
Ditto. Gas is $3.48 here.
I paid $3.29 yesterday.
Ooooh, I hate you!
I’m proud that I made my last tank of gas last a week and a half (I drive a truck). I was driving 55MPH everywhere, but I did it, lol.
$20 A WEEK?????!?!!!!??!?!??!?!? *sigh* I miss those days
I’m lucky if I don’t spend $90 to fill up.
Yea, I am going to hang on to my little car, it’s a beater but gets great gas mileage and it’s paid for!! I would love to get a truck someday…
Want mine? I’m trying to sell it to get a car. A single cab pick up makes it hard to tote around an infant, lol. Minivan? DO NOT WANT!!!!
No thanks! lol!! But good luck! ;D
Scion XB – Kind of ugly but great gas mileage, cheap and tons of cargo space. Good safety ratings too.
Kind of ugly? Baked poo is prettier
What is the car version of the Scion? Those are actually kind of neat looking.
I think you mean the XA – little sporty car. Quite cute but impractical for a parent. I actually am considering an XB … kinda ugly but practical.
If I didn’t think that it would kill me in gas, I would get a 4runner. At least it would get better gas milage than my truck and it would have more room. I’m having trouble resigning myself to getting a car, and I will slit my wrists before I turn into my mother and get a minivan, lol.
But with a minivan, you can take out the seats and put down a matress. Then ditch the kids with a sitter for a while and find a secluded place…
You can totally do that in the front seat of a truck, too, lol. If I was going to get a van, I’d go for the party wagon type van with the great big body and curtains in the windows. Shag carpet, disco ball, the works!
Can’t go wrong with a Saturn. If you need cargo space go for the SW1 or SW2 models. They are the stationwagon version of my car, which is an SL2 (4 door) and gets about 34 miles to a galon, is 13 years old, and still runs really well.
You are unAmerican Ema, you should be driving a big SUV like all of the other McCain stickers I see.
I am different! I am saving money to build rainwater collection stations on the house so I can water my gardens and grow my own food. Kind of hippie sounding isn’t it? I also want cooling towers in my roof so I don’t have to use my air so much, and if I could keep chickens I would!
Check out instructibles – google for it (not sure of link and don’t want to send you bad places)
They have awesome “go green” projects and ideas for water/space conserving garden design and other ways to recycle.
They also have ‘ibles on everything from designing a lighted costume to look like TRON and how to bake and decorate cakes. I think you could find an instructible on just about anything.
Great way to kill a few hours and learn new stuff.
The only gas that McCain knows about comes from his behind.
He’s totally out of touch with Americans.
how would you know if hes out of touch or not? do you live with him? do you follow him around 24/7 and record everything he does and says? Or are you too busy licking obamas behind for him to pay attention to the fact that mccain is in favor of cutting spending and keeping taxes low instead of keeping spending where it is and raising taxes.
Just because someone whos much older than you (or your candidate) isnt hip doesnt mean he is out of touch with Americans. If anyone is out of touch with the American way of life its Obama. He denied on national television voting to raise taxes on individuals making 42k/yr and we all heard it. Turns out he did vote to raise their taxes… gee go figure a politician who lies about his voting record to make himself and his policies seem more likable.
I dont like mccain much and on more than one occasion ive said that he should just change parties since hes always on the other side of the aisle anyway. But when its down to him or a communist I have to vote for 4 more years of the same type of politics we have now rather than vote for someone whos going to raise taxes on everyone once hes been elected. Remember campaign promises only last through the campaign… after the election its politics as usual.
The only change you’ll get with obama is less money in your wallet (assuming youre old enough to have a job) and more government control of the economy. The definition to socialism is a system of government where the state controls the infrastructure (i.e. the banks, the schools, hospitals, churches, etc.) and private enterprise is strictly monitored. Thats not what this country was designed to be. Go read the constitution Articles 1 and 2. The president’s oath of office is to protect and defend the constitution of the united states to the best of his(or her) ability. Thats it. There is nothing in the constitution about providing healthcare, welfare, retirement, housing, food, education or art to the public. You are supposed to get those yourself not have them handed to you.
“someone whos going to raise taxes on everyone once hes been elected.”
Uh. you might want to do some maths and see how many people would be better off taxwise under each candidate, son.
That’ll last just long enougn for Obama to get into office, then we will all be expected to be ‘patriotic’ and pay in more taxes to pay for all of the new, more costly programs that Obama is proposing.
That’s “paytriotic”
Yeah, you’re right. Much more patriotic to borrow the money from our children than to pay for it ourselves. *sigh* Republicans always look for the free ride.
I don’t think it should be borrowed from anyone, really. If a corporation was run like the government it would have gone under 100 years ago. Government is the only entity that grows in spite of failure. I want to see failing programs allowed to go under and replaced with stuff that works. Allow failure to not be a bad thing, but rather something that encourages doing it better the next time. Cut all of this waste and actually BALANCE the damn budget instead of just trying to spend out way out of debt. Both parties are guilty of it, and it’s screwing everyone over.
But don’t try to pull the wool over my eyes and tell me that I won’t be paying more under Obama. He’s said over and over that he wants to raise taxes, and whether or not he wants to do it on the middle class (of which I am firmly a member), he will be forced to in order to pay for all of these new, unweildy, doomed to fail programs he wants to emplement in order to further his dreams of a more massive government.
*putting soapbox away* I’m trying not to get worked up. It is a Sunday after all
One party is a little better at it though. Consider what was happening in 2001 when Clinton was in office. Oh, a balanced Budget. Hadn’t seen one of those since Reagan kept throwing money into the pisser.
Obama’s tax plan is pretty superior to McCain’s as well. You know, like giving the roughly 80-95% of people a tax cut instead of the vast majority going straight into the coffers of the rich.
Yes pina, Bill DID balance the budget, but he was only in office for the first 20 or so days of 2001.
In the current clusterf*ck that we are in, especially given that we keep going into more debt, its a GIVEN that taxes have to go up to prop up our government. The question is only, will it be the rich guy who most likely makes his money through the efforts of the middle class, or the middle class guy who already sees much of his productivity lining the pockets of the ultra rich?
There is nothing in the constitution about providing those things, but there is nothing to the contrary either. And the government has no restrictions on making laws and setting up systems when there is no mention of it in the constitution.
I believe those things come under the preamble to the constitution:
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
It’s the “Promote general Welfare” part that suggests those items lie in the power of the government.
Welfair then vs welfair now, not even close to the same thing.
FAIL ME. Welfare. I haven’t had a lot of sleep
Forgiven
At least you don’t have to get a spanking from herb!
I’m inclined to agree, but that still doesn’t mean that modern welfare is explicitly excluded from government powers
I don’t agree with no welfare, just excessive welfare. I see too much abuse of it in my job to ever be for it in the form it’s in now. I wish there were more safeguards against fully able but lazy people getting welfare to get a nicer house and more expensive car than I have and am working my butt off for. I have no problem helping those who really need it. It’s the ones who don’t need it that get me so pissed I could spit.
Abuse of corporate welfare.
Abuse of any kind of welfare.
You’re preaching to the choir here, babe.
Then get off your ass and fix your party. Elect some old school fiscal conservatives, not these lunatic neo-cons. Don’t circle the wagons and pretend this is a damn sporting event and you have to support your team even when they suck. We Democrats aren’t afraid of a little infighting, yeah it means airing dirty laundry in public, but it needs doing on both sides. Fix your party. Seriously. Because the people you have been electing are not fiscally conservative. They are interventionist, borrow and spend, big government neo-con lunatics.
No, but welfare does mean “the common good”. Frankly, we are a wealthy enough nation that we could provide education, basic medical care, and a guaranteed full belly for every person here without spending a significant amount of our GDP. It’s not only criminal that we don’t do so, it would be an investment that would pay off in increased worker productivity and increased overall production as educated, well fed Americans go on to start more businesses or develop new products. It would also yield benefits internationally, as we become (once again) the nation that shows the world how to make things better for their own people. A *third* benefit would be a reduction in disease and famine, and a fourth (long after I die, probably) a reduction in war. I know, it’ll never go away entirely.
Yea, all those well fed people in New Orleans after Katrina looked like they were just about ready to start some businesses…
You are reinforcing the point he was trying to make, rather than refuting it. He was trying to say that there is NO excuse for a country of our means to have people in that situation.
Where and with what liquid assets could those people started a business?
I’m just saying they looked like they were well fed.
Shinobi, the original implementations of Social Security, Welfare, unemployment, etc were strongly supported by Republicans of the time as a means to placate the masses and prevent the spread of communism. They were also started in a time when it was nearly impossible for many to “get those yourself”, as you say. It was NOT some democratic plot to turn us all into socialists.
Speaking of gas……
Tax calculator in my name – shows what you would pay under each plan. I pay about $800 less under Obama
almost 2K here…
*Waits for Evil Pundit to whine about liberals bashing his war record*
I’m still waiting as well.
EP is so predictable and hate-filled.
EP can’t type right now, his hands can’t stop shaking over the latest poll numbers.
Ex POW and his Special education teacher wife = EVIL and must be stopped !
Do nothing Socialist lawyer and his Socialist Lawyer wife= second coming of Christ.
Go figure.
Seems to confirm my statement about the concept of “Noblesse oblige”.
Really? In what way do you think.
ex POW, his wife, etc = irrelevant to ‘08 election. Derogatory statements about the candidate you don’t back and his wife, ALSO irrelevant. Voting History and stances on the issues that are IMPORTANT to you and America = only thing that’s actually relevant to this election.
Prove actual proof of Obama’s Socialist protocol. Put up or shut up.
You seem to have run out of legitimate ammunition, and have resorted to flinging your own feces. Classy. Which party are the socialists, MegaBob? Hmm? Who is really for handing out wads of cash, who is the real party of big government? It depends on who the cash is going to, doesn’t it? Socialism for the rich is fine, isn’t it? If you don’t think so, why do you keep voting for people who implement socialism for the rich?
POW in Nam? What did those with him think?
http://finepolitics.blogspot.com/2008/01/truth-behind-john-mccain.html
I’m still trying to figure out how the hell this guy got this far. Wasn’t one foot out the door in the primaries?
Cross-over Dem voters trying to stack the deck. They switched back after they picked who they thought would be the easiest candidate to beat.
That’s probably the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard. They sacrificed their chance to vote in their own primaries to vote in the Republican primary? Riiiight.
Apparently, you’ve never heard of Operation Chaos, lol.
Why do you think Hillary lasted so long after she basically lost back in February? I don’t just watch CNN, MSNBC, NPR, or Fox News to get what’s up 
Crossing over has been happening for a while now, just not to the degree it did this year.
What? Rush Limbaugh’s failtacular nonsense? I doubt that made any significant impact. Especially with the margin McCain was defeating his rivals. There just aren’t enough people who care enough or pay attention to do anything like that to swing it that far. Smells like tinfoil hat to me.
Oh and if that was going to happen, why would anyone have picked McCain as the target? 8 years of a largely unpopular Republican administration, economy in tatters, and it’s still not a home run for Obama. Seems to me if they wanted an easier candidate to beat they should have picked Romney or Thompson.
Giuliani.
Giuliani could trot out 9/11 all the time. Romney’s a Mormon and that even scares traditional denomination Republicans. Thompson was the Manhattan District Attorney during 9/11 though… oh wait nm that was on TV.
Thompson got in too late to make much of an impact. THe fact that it’s not a homerun for Obama is not McCain’s fault, most Republicans don’t care much for him, myself included. I would prefer Thompson or Romney. If Operation Chaos didn’t have any effect, Hillary would have been knocked out (like I said before) back in February. She was losing handily, and then for some reason she powered back. Call it what you will, but it was exactly the same time as Rush started OC.
“Would you be more likely to vote for McCain if you knew Obama was a Muslim??”
Lame… Makes no sense.
BAIL OUT, OR – BARBARIANS AT THE GATE?
In the midst of the unsettled financial markets there’s been general agreement about one thing: the outcome of the current crisis will be far-reaching changes to the blobal financial system. For example, Morgan Stanley chief economist Stephen Roach believes the world’s central banks are now being forced to look afresh at how financial bubbles should be handled. Up to now their attitude has been that the markets must correct financial bubbles themselves.
However, the massive emergence of various kinds of derivative instruments created such huge inverted pyramids above an underlying asset class (such as prime mortgages) that things get out of hand when bubbles burst. Roach believes that central banks can hardly afford to condone bubbles in the future.
The question to be answered is: How and when they must take steps to avoid meltdowns?
Fin Week
As some of Wall Street’s most venerable financial institutions teeter on the brink of self-destruction and are either taken over – in the case of Bear Sterns – or, as in the case of Lehman Brothers, allowed to implode, very few financial sectors appear capable of weathering the storms.
In view of the “bail out” agreement reached this past weekend it seems as if financial markets throughout the world will however react positively to this announcement. An announcement in my opinion not made by choice, however rather by force! Financial Guru – Warren Buffet correctly remarked that if the “bail out” plan was not approved – the American Economy would face certain “meltdown”!
In lieu of this it stands to reason that there weren’t much alternatives than to see the bail out plan pass through congress? A certain relief for most – al be it temporary. Both Presidential Candidates voted for the plan as has been seen. Not much of a choice by the looks and sounds of it!
Certainly the pressing question on our minds should be to now take a calm and responsible view back, on what has caused this catastrophy? We should all agree that it is a catastrophy, although suspended perhaps for the moment. One can only call it “suspended” as this has still to play out and we will see how this effects the struggling markets and economy alltogether in the short, medium and long term!
IS THERE ANOTHER 700 BILLION US$ available should this not work?
One cannot help but wonder after pondering on all of this for months on end – who is the biggest terrorist or threat facing America after all? Is it Osama Bin Laden – or worse, is it someone or something, much closer to home? I certainly don’t want to be in the shoes of the current President and wonder if anybody in his right mind would like to be in the future President’s shoes!
However, fill the shoe we have to, and it is now up to every single one of us to realise that the problems facing America is far greater than we want to believe. Republican, Democrat or Independant all stood together, cried together and worked together when the tragedy of 911 struck!
The tragedy of September 2008 is far worse!
We don’t have the liberty of taking on the world at present! No matter how righteous our beliefs are, no matter how convinced we are that terrosism should be fought in every corner, every nook and cranny, and in any place in the world. More Americans have died in this war than in 911 and we are not calling it a tragedy or catastrophy? No, we accept it because we are dying for our country, our beliefs and our ego!
Senator McCain says that he will not see to it that we pull out of this war before victory! He knows how it feels to come home defeated and to live to the consequences of knowing that a lot of people, or so he believes – has died in vain!
Are we staying at war because we don’t want to feel bad? Are we loosing our children because of ego’s?
Or worse, are we staying at war to loose our country and our very excistence?
WE ARE FACING A POSSIBLE MELTDOWN!
IS THIS A BAIL OUT – OR ARE THE BARBARIANS KNOCKING AT THE GATE?
Undoubtedly the bail out is necessary, could it have been avoided – too late to ask! Can it be avoided in the future – we have no alternative but to believe it can! The question is how?
Now, we can tighten up the budgets on every field of the economy, we can harness in every corporate company to be more dilligent in their dealings. We can increase or decrease taxes, impose new legislation, fire the wrong doers or restructure government to be more lean and mean.
All of this is however in vain, if we are still going to remain a “country at war”!
It’s simple economics people! The war is killing America! It costs us a hell of a lot more than it costs Osama Bin Laden and Company to fight this! Perhaps he is a lot more astute than we will give him credit for! Perhaps he has gone into hiding, knowing that sooner or later – the “meltdown” will begin!
Sure we need to keep face in the world! Are we doing this now?
I don’ think so!
It is my opinion that if we wan’t to weather the greatest economic storm ever to hit our shores, we need to act and act now, before it’s to late! Our leader, Republic or Democrat will have to realise that we can’t stay at war and build our economy up again – it’s childish to even contemplate that.
If the world believes we are doing the right thing fighting terrorism offshore, then the world should climb in and help finance this war much more than they are currently doing! If not – we need to pack up and go home before it is too late!
No other country in the world other than America is facing a “meltdown”? Why should we?
I know there is a lot more to it than a normal citizen like you and me know about this alltogether. However, it is time we harness our strength as ONE NATION and forget about politics for now. We need to think about America – all of us!
The “Barbarians are at our Gate”, not in Irak or Pakistan!
GOD BLESS US ALL!
Chase Morgan
Truly spoken like someone who has not had to go out and literally BEG for a job at even minimum wage and get denied because of age discrimination which is so hard to prove but so prevalent. Get ready for the bread lines and soup kitchens.
“Brother Can You Spare A Dime”-sing with me all you unemployed
isn’t this the damn truth.
seems to be his answer for plenty of things these days
McSame was a POW? Never heard that one before! wink wink~