“Ryszard strikes me as more a dark pragmatist: if the world isn’t going to be a great place, then any action owever minor to improve it is a victory over the Chaos. I respect him for it, too, even if I don’t agree with him.”

I missed that earlier, but I appreciate it. A lot.

Tx, R.

Welcome to the forum. I’m not sure how old you are or how much history you know, but here is what my posts were based upon.

The phrase was “main enemy” (glavny protivnik?). I heard it in an interview with a defector who had been a member of the KGB, then of the post-Soviet FSB. (I was driving at the time and unable to write down the man’s name, although I believe it was Oleg Gordievsky, aka “Comrade G”.)

Who one’s “main enemies” are is not something any Russian official would announce. The point I meant to make is that the Russian Federation has not changed in that way from the USSR, and that it is not my opinion.

Just don’t knock masturbation in any of its form.

I already know what is in it for them, I am talking about us. I don’t live in China or Russia so their feelings aren’t high on my list of things to give a damn about. I will care about them when our economy isn’t shit.

Okay, short version: What is it worth to Russia and China for us to remain engaged with the worst elements of Islam in Iraq and Afghanistan, rather than saying, “Right, lads, run along to your home countries and attack the *other* Great Satans”? As much we are disliked, they also dislike those countries for being officially godless. (To the extent that they need a reason.)

So we are paying them to do a favor for… them?

Just pondering a different angle, mind you.”

DWN-We all agree that we are not given all the information by our governments. You may or may not agree that governments do things among themselves which run counter to their public stands. (French President Chirac was always vocally against us, but French intelligence usually cooperated with us.) I may argue the case elsewhere that I have the wherewithal to infer more from the information that we do get publicly. But something just occurred to me which you may want to consider.

(1) We have many reasons for being in Iraq. One is to keep the baddies from coming *here*; seems to be working. (2) Russia can’t afford to concentrate their forces against the West; their entire southern border, with the meaningless exception of Mongolia, is comprised of enemies; and, with the exception of China, *Muslim* enemies, who pose just as great a threat to Russia as they do to anyone else. (3) By extension, we are doing the civilized world (but particularly Russia) a favor by drawing fire away from the Americas, Europe, and most of Africa and Asia.

“Nations do not have friends or enemies. They have interests.” Come to think of it, even China benefits. They too have extensive borders with Muslim countries, as well as a substantial Muslim minority of their own. Estimates range from 27 to *100 million* (has to do with their definition of a minority).

I believe in the good in people but I have seen more evidence to the apathy in people. I won’t say evil, I won’t dignify the concept of monolithic evil outside of a fictional storyline.

The presence of assholes over here does not stop the presence of assholes over there. As for rednecks with guns, they were killing blacks and other minorities long before there was a war in Iraq so I can’t accept that as reason to stop a war dead in its tracks when the enemy is still fighting.

I want a better place for my kids. I want the war over, hell I wish we could have found a better way. I don’t trust McCain since his ideas are no different than what got us there. But I don’t believe we can just believe in the good of others and back off.

Ugh, I think I somehow left my point behind so I will have to stop my rant there and apologize for its lack of completion. Hopefully some use can still be garnered from it.

Ni hao?